General Chat

The government have announced:
'Universities are to be allowed to charge up to £9000 tuition fees.
But, if they charge over £6000 they have to show that they are encouraging the less well off to attend!!!'

What planet are they on?

...aww.... thanks ice.

The way this government talks about 'the poor' - I sometimes think they don't know the meaning of 'poor' - they seem to think the 'poor' are from another planet - and could earn as much as them (the politicians) - and rip everyone else off just as well as MP's can - if they only 'put in the effort'!! LOL

21,000 graduates from last year still have not managed to obtain work. Perhaps the huge fees will deter them and press them towards apprenticeships for combining work and studying.

It is ironic that those in government all had free university education. I'll sign the petition too

I'm old enough to have had a full grant for Uni, but didn't take my degree until 1996.
I've never earned enough money to pay back my student loan!!! At the moment, I have to earn £40,000 to pay it back (that's a laugh!!)
Possibly, because of people like me, they lowered the amount you had to earn before you paid back the loan to minimum wage level!! It's risen slightly since then.
I did try getting a relevant job - I wanted to become a graduate teacher in 2001 - but was 'disqualified' because I was neither a male, nor a member of an ethnic minority!!!
So much for being English since the Hugeonauts (sp) (although dad's dad is in question!), living in England - and being born a female!

That's since changed - but I've also got older and peed off with the system!!

Eh gods , don't get me started on this one !

We paid full tuition fees for my dau and son thro Uni, tho they both had student loans.. repayable of course.Mum and dad still supplemented them.

Dau is in employment, son just graduated and hasn't secured a job in his chosen field of IT yet, fortunately has his seasonal job with As*a, so has money coming in.

I don't think that those in Government now would have received free Uni Education, grants were available in the 70's, my sister and I had partial grants, dad wasn't on marvellous wages !.. but he had to pay !

Still I'll sign the petition :)

Sandie,
I don't think the majority of our 'leaders' are still paying back their loans!! Mummy & daddy probably paid all that was needed.
My daughter worked whilst she was at uni - I couldn't fund her, and she was paying back her loan. Some students, when both she and I were at Uni got the loan out and put it in a high interest account. When they left uni, they immediately paid back the loan and walked away with a nice fistful of interest!! Okay if you can do it, but a slap in the face for the rest of us.

Daughter is now doing a PGCE and putting herself more in 'hock' - but since signing up for it, her previous job (in the Environment Agency) has been 'redesignated' - they're all having to reapply for their jobs and, if kept on will have to move from Brighton to Reading!!
Her partner, who worked there with her, is looking for a new job, as, even if he keeps his job, has no desire to move to Reading.

Don't get me started on apprenticeships. My son wanted to do an apprenticeship in graphic design but Wales at that time (and still don't) didn't offer apprenticeships in this field. He could however do an apprenticeship in mechanics according to Career Wales! Now unfortunately my son has no interest in cars whatsoever so why try fittings a square peg into a round hole. He never wanted to go the university route.

Now my dau on the otherhand has just started uni and unless we help her out has £5.20 a day to live on - and no we're not a well off family. She works Saturday and Sunday to help out with her costs but by doing so is now being penalised for costs of dental treatment and such like. I think by the time she comes out of uni she'll have a huge debt. One of her text books alone has cost £95!!! How can it be justified.

Esta - re text books a good site is Abe Books. Used it for my gdau. study books. Re apprenticeships, my husband for some years worked for a large international company who did not take on apprentices but 'poached'.
He fought hard and long for a number of years and finally succeeded indeed in his retirement presentation - it was said' those of you who have served company apprenticeships or are serving them then thank this man, he is responsible for it.' I know it is not easy for youngsters and only said on Monday to gdau and her boyfriend (mid twenties) that I am glad I am not in their shoes.

Does anyone know if it only affects new entrants to the system, or does it include those who start this year? If the fees are to increase, then so must the loans to cover the cost. Even though the loan is a debt to be repaid, the mind set amongst Students and financial institutes is that it ‘doesn’t count’ as a Degree is seen as a tool for higher earnings in future years. I’m more concerned if the cost of further qualifications is increased – MA, MSc etc. Some careers have this as a requirement and they can cost up to £10,000 (full time for one year) to be funded entirely by the student or their families. No loans available from the EA or Government! Youngest took out the full loan, was supported by us, and worked while at Uni. She is now using the original loan to fund an MSc. over 2 years, while working part time to support her expenses.

Now apprentices – a friend’s OH is one man Joiner with an outbuilding in his rural garden as his workshop, and is snowed under with work. A few years ago, he thought of taking on an apprentice, but the hoops he would have had to jump through were ridiculous. So H&S regs (we’re talking separate loos and restrooms here) have stopped another young person learning a worth while trade.

DET

i think there will be another "brain drain" as people do their degree here and go abroad to avoid repaying the loan (via their income taxes) or else, as in my daughters case, go abroad to study.
It will be cheaper for her to go to uni in Auckland, NZ as a foreign student than to continue her studies in England.
As the most expensive degrees will be the "real" ones, medicine, engineering, law etc this could prove expensive, and not just financially, to the country in the longer term.

It is sad Eddie that we do not look after our own and the future of the country. Much has been lost already. Yet the illegals etc have everything handed to them on a plate.

My Daugter opted to do her Degree locally. She still pays just over £3,000 per year for tuition fees but did not take out maintainence loan.
She has two full Days of lectures, and works 3 days a week in a local supermarket, more if any extra shifts come up.
She passed her 1st year exams and now in 2nd year.
Daughter is doing her degree in buisness management but I feel for the youngsters taking subjects such as Medicine, physio, teaching etc where most days are filled with lectures and they do not have the time to work part time as well.

My youngest is 12 and with things giong as they are I dont think he will be able to afford uni.

Teresa

Can't find exact figures, but as a rule of thumb, students from outside the EU pay considerably more than UK students. There could be some arrangements with their governments who will fund them.

They either have to pay up front, or by installments. If the fees are not paid, they are then either kicked off the course, or not Graduated. I don't think they can get loans from the British government /LEA

I never did manage to get a job in graphic design and/or photography. That's how I ended up self-employed but I've just had to close my business because I couldn't support the losses any more. But all the jobs I ever saw in that area wanted people with industry experience, which obviously nobody has got straight out of university.

I don't even seem to be able to get a job stacking shelves or waiting on tables at the moment - I went back to where I used to work during college and asked, only to be told that they've changed their recruitment approach (and there always used to be vacancies there). And this week I've had rejection letters back from two job applications that I knew I could have done - my mum reckons it's probably because employers are wondering why I'm applying to wait on tables and serve in shops when I've got a degree, but there isn't much else on offer round here. It's really frustrating because (and I'm sure there are millions of people my age, older and younger in the same mindset) I do want to work, I just want an opportunity to get started.

I'm getting quite worried about how old my generation are going to be before they can afford to retire - I could easily imagine I'll be working till I'm 65, but that's only going to be any use if I can get a job.

I do quite a bit of voluntary stuff in my spare time, but it's not exactly going to pay for Christmas presents.

Regarding "foreign" students coming here to study, because of an influx of English students into Scotland (where there are no uni fees) wanting to do university courses, Engish people are now to be treated as "foreigners" and charged accordingly to study in Scottish universities.

Esta~~
Dau and son used to get their text books from Amazon, good prices,comparatively.

Rita~~
D E T is correct, the UK do not fund foreign students , I do hope that also includes ones with the EU !!!!

Eddie~~~
It is so weird and unfair that students from any country in the UK are treated differently if they go a Uni not in their 'country'.. unless of course they do it because it is cheaper in Scotland.. then I think it is unfair on the Scottish Government.
In Wales, students who live in Wales and go to Welsh Uni's are able to get a Grant from the Welsh Assembly.. so we to have an influx of students giving a Welsh address to study in a Welsh Uni... it's not on !!
It's UK and they should all be treated the same, IMHO......

Sandie.

Students living/born in Scotland pay no fees. Friend's gson from N.Ireland who attends Dundee pays fees (although I believe according to article last week or so are lower than those paid in England). Just checked £1820. This gets worse - EU nationals will not pay either but the English, Welsh and N. Irish have to!!

Eventually I found some figures, if any one is interested. I am confused if the cost to EU students is subsidised by their government, or ours. For the purpose of this exercise, I looked at 3 ‘good’ English Universities. Figures for the academic year 2010/11 and fees payable yearly. Multiply by 3 for the overall cost of a 3 year Degree course.

EU- people from the EU including Great Britain.
OS – from outside the EU.

Leeds – EU – £3290
OS – Arts degree £10900 pa, Mixed Arts and Science £12600 pa, Science £14200 pa

Warwick – EU - £3290 pa
OS - £11500 - £15000 pa depending on the course

Oxford – EU - £3290 pa
OS - £18000 - £20000 pa depending on the course.

Perhaps that puts things into perspective?

And as a family living in England, don't start me on the inequalities of the costs for those choosing to study in a different UK country!

Multiply by three and maybe add a little extra on. The tuition fees for my course have gone up each year.

But why in Scotland do EU students pay nothing? Unless of course I read it wrong. Google scots university fees.