General Chat

Mandy, you think that this Labour governemt is not labour at all - Right and this has been known surely since they first got in - New Labour = Old Conservative - and hence the reason that there is very little opposition and the present tories are floundering and trying to come up with New Conservative policies - unfortunately as soon as they broadcast their new policies, the New Labour filches them. Cant see how we are ever going to get out of this mess - especially when the Conservatives keep looking for a new leader - but in my opinion it is not a new leader that is required but policies that N L could not begin to follow OR T B decides that he has had enough and the populace turns against the next N L leader (G Brown ?). And can anyone explain what John Prescott does ? just pray that he never makes it to P M.

I'm with you there Joe.......... Prescott for PM!!!!....Nooooooooo! The way that I see it is that in this bland world, that we have found ourselves in, the main ingredient missing is a charasmatic leader, and when a party finds one they will be able to impliment the changes. But when you look at some of the leaders that have had that vital ingredient like, Margaret Thatcher and Hitler, charisma can also be a dangerous thing! So we have to be careful as the present climate is ripe for someone to step in and dominate. But it would have to be a powerful person to make the changes. But as the current trend is international, it would take tremendous ability to be able to swim against the flow! But when is all said and done you can't please all of the people all of the time! Just be nice if they managed to please a few of them!!!!! :-) Mandy

Dave, I don't believe in Party politics, but if you're talking about constituency representation or regional representation, then I do agree that what you vote for is what you should get. I'm more concerned with what's happening nationally - the huge amount of debt that Gordon Brown's policies are causing. This 'soak the rich' attitude sickens me. What is the point of people like me, who started life in a poor family which got poorer when my father died, having worked hard for decades to achieve a decent home and a decent standard of living, only to have Brown push me back down the ladder again with massive tax hikes. My widowed mother never got handouts from Harold Wilson's Government when I was growing up and we lived on the breadline, so I don't see why I should pay huge tax increases to prop up other people who don't seem badly off by comparison. I'm all for giving help to people who genuinely need it, but there are far too many who get away with handouts they don't deserve, and there's far too much waste on over-manned, excessively bureaucratic schemes that take money with one hand and redistribute it with the other. There's been quite a lot in the papers lately about over-payments being clawed back and pushing people into debt. Why doesn't Brown raise the tax thresholds and allow people to keep more of the money they earn, rather than keep giving them bits back in dribs and drabs all over the place? And why do I read regularly that there are more hugely wealthy people in the UK now than ever before, yet our public services are crying out for funds - nurses, for example, are grossly underpaid, yet our hospitals now have management systems that were never necessary in the past - more waste on unnecessary salaries, office space, etc, etc. How much has our involvement in the Iraq war cost this country - and are the Iraqi people any better off today? If you listen to Peter Mandelson - has he REALLY got OUR best interests at heart in the EU? Why do 50% of young people need to attend University? Where are all the jobs for all these graduates? Is it right that our PM's wife can cash in on being the PM's wife? Why are houses in the North being bulldozed and the South losing green belt to build? Why can't businesses shift North and let people live and work there, instead of this relentless loss of jobs there coupled with the relentless southward drift of population? There's quite a lot about the Conservatives that I don't care for, but the Labour Party has never done me any favours, and I'd NEVER vote for them. If they were the only option, I'd not vote at all. ... but, as ever, you are entitled to your opinion and I don't hold it against you. If we all meet up one day, there'll be you, me and Gwynne hammer and tongs at each other, I'll bet - but we'll still be friends afterwards! LoL CB >|< X

Lone voice in the wilderness maybe but I think we are very furtunate to live in such a well run country. For all our sniping (national hobby, lol) we DO have well run public services, an exceptional health care system, free education for ALL, a damn good police force (despite my comments to the contrary sometimes), we have safety, freedom and the knowledge of where our next meal is coming from. We do not live in fear or dread a knock on the door. We are free to make disparaging remarks about our political leaders without death squads visiting. We have a public transport system that knows roughly where it's going and safe clean drinking water. I am very happy to live where I do. I thank God that I am blessed enough to have such an easy life.

Do I hear an echo? You think you have problems - read Patsy's thread on same sex 'marrriage'. It's always funny when, after an election, everyone says 'Well I didn't vote for them'. Our probem here is that there are more people in the East than the West and the government is chosen before we even get chance to vote - and the East doen't want to give up it's dominance.

There must be millions of people worldwide who would love to live in a country as badly run as ours.

CB I agree with you on a lot of points. Even though politically I may be classed as on the other side to you, I am not happy with so many aspects of our life at the moment. I don't think that common sense has a particular political affiliation. But common sense doesn't appear to be common in the house of commons .......... LOL Wendy I think that my greatest fears are the gradual changes that threaten this comaratively priviledged life that we lead! :-) Mandy

I only know one thing, I personally would never have stood as a candidate, so perhaps it's a good job everyone isn't like me! Do we get the govt we deserve? I do wish we had some form of PR though, in Trafford we just accept that Conservatives will get in whatever we vote! Lily

Wendy, All the things you mention that you like about living in this country haven't just happened because we've had a few Labour governments in the past century. Millions of people have suffered and died over previous centuries to defend this country and allow the evolution of the system of government we have today. The fact is that other countries haven't been through that process yet and have taken a different path through the past. Yes, we are very lucky to live what are, by comparison, privileged lives, but they come at a huge cost. Looking back at our history, there have been many attempts at different forms of government, but the present system has evolved over time. It hasn't just been plonked into place by some whizzkid full of unproven theories with no experience of the realities outside academia. The recent EU referenda in France and The Netherlands have shown that governments there are out of touch with their people on key issues. The same is true here, but the truth is hidden. If you look at the results of the last General Election, the Labour Party were voted into power by a mere handful of the country's total electorate, so I don't see how that can be fair, and I always wonder how many thousands just vote for a certain Party because 'we've always voted that way'. I don't know anyone who's better off under this government, and the country as a whole certainly isn't. If they had their way, we'd end up as nonentities in an EU superstate and be a whole lot worse off. Gordon Brown took office with a healthy economy but wasn't slow to take the credit for that at every opportunity. He's now plunged the country into debt and robbed hundreds of thousands of people of the pensions they've worked all their lives for. If he'd spent the money on something worthwhile, maybe it could be justified, but where has it gone? John Prescott's building plans don't bear thinking about - hundreds of thousands of homes to be built along the tidal Thames estuary, when sea levels are rising and the risk of flooding is greater than ever before? Casinos all over the place? 24-hour alcohol licences? Seems to me like a policy of give 'em 'bread and circuses' and they won't notice what else we do! How stupid do they think we are? CB >|<

I too am not happy with the way our Country is run. Unfortunately these days we are still trying to interfere with other Countries. The parable of the Mote & Beam springs to mind. Our elected Government should concern itself with the management of the United Kingdom. I object to being bossed about by a government which was voted AGAINST by the majority of the electorate, and who take no notice of the Will of the People. I want a 'None of the above Wan*ers!' box on my Ballot papers, rather than having to accept whoever the local Party is promoting for their own ends. Maybe MPs should be paid Minimum Wage so that only those with a desire to improve our lot would want to do the job, rather than Self-seeking Professional Politicians who are doing it for the Money and the (tainted) Glory.

Hear, hear, Jim! CB >|<

CB - I agree with you absolutely that people have had to die and have sacrificed a lot to achieve the country we have today. As a result slavery has been abolished, children are no longer forced to work and us plebs get to live at relatively the same standard as the nobs. We all have political freedom and we DO have some of the best standards in the world. However if anyone thinks that martyrdom or sacrifice is still called for then maybe they need to move to a much more exciting militant country where they can get their thrills. I am all for having a moan about sub standard services but I do get sick of hearing people go on and on and on and on over the same worn stuff without pulling their fingers out of their backsides and actually DOING something. The great people who have reformed this country didn't just sit on their a**es whinging they got off them and actually DID SOMETHING. Anyone can get involved in politics if they really want to make a difference. The PCC is a great place for anyone to start to cut their political teeth. As a nation we complain to olympic standard. I realise it is terribly unfashionable but what the hell is wrong in realising what we have and being thankful for it.

Don't lose sight either that one man's meat is another man's poison. My father and I are diametrically opposed on a lot of political issues. Measures that would benefit his company would be a major headache for mine. What might make CB happy could end up causing long term problems for Grandpa Jim. And, as raised in a roundabout way by Fred (hi Fred) how in hell's name will Jaguar survive if Prescott were to lose his seat???

Fred Im sorry not going to get into any political debate with you everybody is entitled to their opinions. But it is getting very BORING now every time you post with ''B'liar'' his name is Blair and now another personel attack against John Prescott calling him a name.Why dont you stick to putting forward your view without being abusive it would be much more readable Fred. Only the other day you added to a thread saying you didnt mind a little bit of innuendo and double entendre' but you hated people being ABUSIVE please Fred practise what you preach and call them by their correct names whether you like their policies or not they are entitled to that. Dave

Fred what a boring tedious person you are some times! Dave

You rethink your statement Fred and call them by their proper names and I will willingly retract you are being more insulting to them calling one a liar and the other obeste than I am being to you calling you boring and tedious. Dave and I might add I would say the same to you if you called Howard or Kennedy names regarding their station, it is not needed to use those names you are intelligent Guy who I like reading your comments but I dont think you have to put those disparaging comments in every time you post about Tony Blair.

Now there's a thought, if all the parties put forward a budget and people voted which one they wanted, and had to live by the one they voted for, I wonder what would happen? Of course everyone would HAVE to vote to make this workable!! LOL Val

So Fred you are a fattist then are you as well, anybody who is fat is called Fatty what a nice man you are sometimes Fred GROW UP. Dave Fred in the playground nn nn nn nn! you are fat pathetic!!!

Can I ask - did all you people with such strong opinions go out and vote? Anyone who didn't has no right to complain, in my humble opinion. Lily

I voted. xx I like Tony and Gordon so nobbly boo sucks!! (lol)