General Chat

Jan has a very good point. It is easy to take a sanitised armchair view and gloss over what really happened. In the case of Hindley and Brady, the latter was an animal beyond belief. He had already exhausted his perverted appetite with Hindley herself, as she admitted years later, and had to seek satisfaction with either young boys or girls, which he then killed immediately afterwards, if not before or during his disgusting acts. Hanging was probably too easy for them, so perhaps the two got justice by serving life.

i think we also need to remember there was no dna in those days ,the things we have now,and ways of proof far outway what we had then.

I have read this thread with interest but it still has not changed my opinion . The death penalty is useless . If one person out of 1000 is wrongly executed it fails .There are lots of quotes from the bible, all can be interpretted one way or another , but if we go that way, one of the ten comandments states 'Thou shalt not kill'. Surely that applies to everyone ? I hope they never ,ever bring back the death penalty ... kim

There are lots of reasons why I don't want to see the death penalty back, I have given them on other threads and people have given the same reasons on this thread but my main thought in the cases Catherine mentioned.................. death is way too kind a punishment.. Rosex

Man hanged 53 years ago was innocent By Owen Bowcott A conviction for the murder of a cinema manager, that sent a young Liverpool labourer to the gallows 53 years ago, was yesterday overturned by the court of appeal. George Kelly was executed at Walton jail on Merseyside in March 1950, following what was then the longest criminal trial in English legal history. His plea for clemency had been rejected by the home secretary of the day, James Chuter Ede. Announcing their decision yesterday, three appeal judges, Lord Justice Rix, Mr Justice Douglas Brown and Mr Justice Davis, concluded the original verdict was 'unsafe'. The case was the oldest referred to the criminal cases review commission, the statutory body that investigates alleged miscarriages of justice. The crown did not attempt to uphold the conviction. During the appeal, the judges heard that a statement given by a prosecution witness, claiming a man called Donald Johnson had confessed to committing the crime, had not been disclosed at the original trial. The crime for which Kelly was hanged shocked postwar Britain. Leonard Thomas, 44, manager of the Cameo Cinema in Wavertree, Liverpool, and his assistant, John Catterall, 30, were killed during a bungled burglary in March 1949. While the audience watched a thriller, a man in a brown coat, trilby hat and mask burst into the manager's first-floor office as the night's takings were being counted. Thomas was shot in the chest; Catterall, who arrived moments later, was hit in the hand, chest and back. The gunman panicked and fled, leaving the cash untouched. Pressure on the police for arrests mounted and as many as 65,000 people were questioned. An anonymous letter eventually led detectives to Kelly, a petty criminal nicknamed the 'little Caesar of Lime Street', and Charles Connolly, then 26, who allegedly acted as lookout. In the first trial, which lasted 13 days, the jury failed to reach a verdict. The two men were then tried separately. Connolly pleaded guilty in February 1950 to robbery and conspiracy and was sentenced to 10 years in prison. He died in 1997, protesting his innocence. The court of appeal overturned both convictions, even though the crown opposed the application on behalf of Connolly. 'However much the Cameo murders remain a mystery, we regard the circumstances of Kelly and Connolly's trials as a miscarriage of justice which must be deeply regretted,' Lord Justice Rix said yesterday. During the hearing Orlando Pownall QC, for the crown, said Donald Johnson had told a man called Robert Graham, a serving prisoner, that he had been responsible for the shootings. Graham made a second statement to police several months later incriminating Kelly and Connolly and was later granted immediate release. But Graham's September 1949 statement implicating Johnson was not discovered until 1991 when a member of the public with an interest in the case was given access to Merseyside police files. The prosecution accepted that the document was genuine and in the absence of evidence to the contrary conceded that Graham must have spoken to Chief Inspector Herbert Balmer, one of the officers involved in the inquiry. Mr Pownall told the judges: 'It is not proposed by the crown to dwell on any conspiracy theories... If there had been a conspiracy it seems unlikely anyone involved would have left that original document in a box to be found years later.' Ch Insp Balmer, he said, like most of those involved in the case, had long since died. Kelly's daughter, Kathleen Hughes, left the courtroom in tears, refusing to comment. She had previously stated: 'I have waited a long, long time for this day. I hope now I can give him a decent Christian burial, which I have previously been thwarted from doing.' Robin Makin, the Kelly family's lawyer, said it was a 'deplorable' situation. 'George Kelly's brothers made efforts on his behalf from the time of the conviction in 1950 and there was nothing that could be done. There is tremendous concern about the way in which matters were handled at that time.' Connolly's brother, Eddie, said afterwards: 'A lot of doubters at the time will have been proven wrong today. We've known all along that they were innocent.'

How strange I posted on here about half hour ago my views but it has gone? Anyway pedophiles and murderers don't deserve to live as the families of victims will never recover and their quality of life is ruined. I just believe in an eye for an eye. Bring the death penalty back. Look at the likes of that Ian Huntley sat there in prison being fed and looked after after what he did. All that money wasted on the likes of that scum could be put into the NHS.

Anyone who takes a life should be hung, its about time the law was changed in this country too many murders being committed we need to have a deterrent, life for a life as the saying goes Lilxx PS with DNA there's no excuses these days as to who is responsible for such acts

I believe that if there is 100% proof that they did it. They should be made to suffer the same ordeal that these victims have suffered. We are making life far to easy for the evil scum that we are keeping in comfort. Why was Hindley, West, Sutcliffe allowed to live after what they have done to people. Yes I know there have been miscarriages of justice but if there is no doubt at all as there are in some cases. I dont see why they are allowed to live in comfort. Tha bible says An Eye for an Eye I used to do Voluntry work for our local N.S.P.C.C , I saw what some parents did. They need to be sterilised without pain relief. Sorry if I offend anyone with some harsh words but I feel very stronly about this Jan x

I Think they should bring the death penalty back over here. Why should people be allowed to get away with murdering anyone. I see it like this a life for a life. Lisa

I am completely against it.. I am old enough to remember also, the young Bennet lad, they hung him. Did any of you see the film *the green mile*? Well if you remember the incident where they used a plastic based sponge instead if an organic one?? and the terribly death it caused that man? Well that scene was based on a real man to whom that happened..... and he was innocent. I wish I could remember his name, but he and his wife were both sentenced to death. They spent many years in jail, and were later proved to be innocent , his wife was released and got the usual insulting pay out. Deanna X

Was Pierrpoint the executioner? how strange to be run over by him!! I've always been against the death penalty as mistakes can and have been made but after reading about Letitia I think it should be brought back for child abuse /murder. I also think anyone who harms a child should be sterilised immediately no questions asked. I know of someone who caused the death of her baby, after a few years in jail she is now married with another family with new identity, sorry don't think that's right ... but only my opinion. Norah

thanks kim my main point was the time wasted at core meetings, where social workers discused there holiday plans and last nights tea. i attended every core meeting with my son with aspergers and found them a complete waste of time. time that could of been spent protecting kids from abuse. If i was a social worker i would not expect my day to start a 9 and finish at 5, if i thought i could save some kid from this 24 hrs a day i would put in till that child was safe , why do the job otherwise.

Yes, it should be brought back as long as there is no doubt they were guilty. Marion

sorry catherine i deleted my post , think i was a bit biased as ive only seen bad too, however i do think the death panalty should be brought back if there is no doubt.

just to throw this in not that it has any bearing on what we are discussing my dad was run over by a car when he was young (he was born 1937) by guess who Albert Pierrpoint-does that name mean anything to anyone??? catherine xx

If we are looking at the death penalty across the board , you can,t just pick out certain crimes , I agree with Lesley , here,s an example ... Someone murders another person, is on the run , knows if they are caught they will die , what reason do they have to think twice about killing again and again , you only die once ??? We as a civilized society say killing is wrong , how can we then justify killing as a punishment . Do as I say ,not as I do ??? Doesn,t work, just my opinion xxx

Yes ,I belive when anyone commits blatant murder then they should be put to death,,,,and I would personally have no quarms of doing it, sadly should it be a member of my own family then the same rules apply,,,,,,,, I think the jail terms in this country are in some part given by complete fools,,,,,,,,,,why is it automatic life to serve at least 20/25 years for killing a police officer, --and life to serve at least 10--12 years for the murder of an innocent baby/.child/young person..... But as our system is,,,Life should mean life,,till death,,,,,,,,,,,

I have always been agains the death penalty to be honest but in cases of child abuse like above I would have no hesitation catherine xx

Yes I am one of the believers in the death penalty It isn't just the offender we get rid of but puts off the next generation to commit these crimes eventually it would be wiped out altogether skwirrel

hi hun,i think it should be brought back.when a child is murdered,or elderly person,or a racial murder,serial killers,then definatley oh and ........paedophiles.and the sickos who put stuff like that on web sites. and yes i could do the job and sleep comfortably at nite.xxx