General Chat

Hi David I was listening to Tony Blair on the 'Today' programme this morning and of course as expected he was still full apologises about the incident, well it is very embarrasing. I believe Walter has been a Labour supporter for 57 years, so he would have been brought up the old way heckle disagreements and praise agreements. I think he should be allowed on the rostrum to speak his objections as a one off but that's not going to happen, pity. I think its an unfortunate incident especially because of Walter Wolfgang's age as this really made it look even worse, then if he had been a young man. I don't think it's isolated or just going to be a Labour Party problem, anyone now shouting an objection anywhere will be pounced upon by over anxious security staff i.e. Bouncers. Pat x

Robert - excellent post. Sadly you are SO right....

what about jack straws freedom of speech. your supposed to be there to listen to what your party is all about, if you start shouting you will be removed no matter what age.

Eddie, you do not seem to understand what we mean by 'freedom of speech.' Jack Straw's freedom of speech has not been impinged, and nobody here has said that he should be denied his right to it. What we are objecting to is that someone who does not agree with him, and does not agree to such an extent that he cannot keep quiet during Jack Straw's speech, should be treated in such an objectionable way. Had Walter stormed the rostrum, and removed Mr Straw's freedom to speak, we would have been berating him. What is so frightening at the moment is that no-one in this governement ever stands up to debate unless the audience has been hand-picked to agree with them. TB made the mistake early in his career of thinking that the WI were easy meat; they humiliated him. After a barracking by a worried mother outside a hospital, his minders no longer allow the hoi polloi anywhere near his illustrious personage - even royalty has more contact with the people! More recently, he thought he could handle schoolchildren, only to be thoroughly trounced by a young girl! Whereas as previous PMs would often walk to work, TB has WHitehall closed down, and then a multi-vehicle escort. I repeat the warning - our servants are now becoming our masters. Rob

Eddie Heckling a politician or any public speaker is not infringing their freedom of speech. Have you never seen tv footage of the Houses of Parliament? Walter Wolfgang wasn't creating a disturbance - he shouted one word. Regardless of his age, I don't think anyone should be manhandled like that for expressing an opinion contrary to a member of the government's. Do you think it's fair enough that this man (and others in Brighton this week according to Radio 2) was stopped under the Prevention of Terrorism laws? I don't understand how the police even got involved. Amid all the apologies, has anyone noticed that it's being put down to over zealous stewards? It's the poor wot gets the blame..lol

Sorry Robert - we were typing at the same time. Well said:)

i saw that on GMTV this morning, they were saying something like the security did that as they are very nervous of terrorism ect! Well they didnt look nervous to me, they looked more like Bullies!!! The man was let back in today though wasnt he...i think its disgraceful though, all he said was 'nonsense' and got attacked for it! Idiots! x

Robert/ Dave I agree with most of what you have said. But in a way freedom of speech and fair debate have been destroyed in this country by people and media who are just out to make publicity by trying to catch out politicians and embarissing them, and not concentrating on real issues.

You cannot expect anything else from the People we now have infesting our Government. also, What about the other man Ejected because he remonstrated with the people who removed the old man who shoutd at 'The Man of Straw' are we going to see a return of 'Mosleys Blackshirts',The KGB,STASSI Etc.? seems very much like it. These people should be charged with,Assault,Wrongful Arrest and Unlawful imprisonment. Hal.

Harold Wilson used to welcome hecklers. In his day it was the tories who evicted them. D

Oh yes, Eddie, you are so right there - you cannot overestimate the power of the media. How a person is presented by the television and the press has a direct influence upon his/her success - the best example I can think of there is William Hague. While leader of the Conservatives, he was always photographed with the cameras held high, emphasising his lack of height, and his balding pate; his speeches were always carefully cut for prime-time TV, so that what he was saying often seemed to be utterly ridiculous - wait until the more high-brow (and less popular) current affairs programmes later in the night, and his comments would be shown in context with the rest of his speech, and he would regularly wipe the floor with TB and his cronies (indeed, it was Hague's regular humiliations of TB that convinced him to reduce PM Question Times to once a week, then TB even found himself too busy for that!) One must always be wary of what is shown on the TV and in the papers - remember, most of the media is controlled by a small handful of people. Rob

David....members of the audience on the wright stuff this morning likened it to the nazis when they came to power.....its discusting.xx

Hi ya just caught up with this thread! I agree with Fred (with cats), the first thing that came to mind when I heard about this was George Orwells 1984 - it is spooky how much we are movin towards this sort of state. Cheers Kaz - still spooked (literaly)

Alan, you are SO right about the BBC's bias - I first noticed it in Kate Adie's report on the Libyan air raid xxxx years ago, and it reached a peak with its excuses for Robin Cook's shenanigans with his secretary in the 'organ loft' (for readers of a certain magazine); excuses that left a bad taste after their sanctimonious cant against the Tories' various romps just prior to the 1997 election. Much of the news on all the TV channels now is more opinion than fact, with outrageous suppositions being drawn out of the most rudimentary information. Oddly enough, though, I do think that the system we do have does work - okay, it throws up the occasional turnip, but, generally, we do quite well out of it - except when we are let down by the people of Scotland, who have just wasted TWO opportunities to give TB a good slap. As for American 'democracy' - well, there, you can vote for a rich person, or a very rich person. Rob

Kaz, Big Brother was here before 1984, it just took a long time for people to wake up to that fact, it's too late to turn back now. Maybe the old man was a terrorist, he had a 500lb bomb in his walking stick, he was only doing a dummy run, next week he's going to use a zimmer, i'll let you into a secret he works me don't tell anyone. (shh). ;))) Micheal.

Robert, May I just add a round of applause to everything you've said - you've saved me the trouble! CB >|<

Robert I was having a rant the other night about the quality of news reporting - so much is now speculation instead of fact and it drives me mad:)

Ah well, there you are, David. An ideal job for YOU - roving reporter, telling us all what REALLY happens with no political (or other) bias. CB >|<

I don't think I'm a calm enough person to report without bias CB lol