General Chat

so if everyone has the right to an opinion and has the right to be heard, no one has any objection to this thread!!!!!!! You see Helen i do not agree with you, every does not have the right to be heard at all espesially(spelling) when the one doing all the voicing is making sure they are loud and clear and everyone elses opinion is put down and i do not agree with such politics on a board where everyone should feel comfortable. This debate has nothing to do with anything Lucia has said, Helen

not sure what thread is being referred to here but as far as I am aware Lucia has enjoyed the 'DEBATE' and not felt vicitmised for holding an opinion! xx

I once heard someone say 'Opinions are like belly-buttons. Everyone's got one and they are worth nothing'. But people should have the right to express their opinions and to have them heard, whether or not they disagree with them. That's the fundamental principle of a free country. IfI upset anyone by asking what 'right' it is that people have to smoke, sorry, but I am not aware that there is any such right enshrined in our unwritten constitution. I did not mean that smokers do not have rights. The problem in a democracy is balancing everyone's rights. nell

I think that sometimes people get a bit carried away and passionate about their opinions, but I don't think anyone means any harm by it. There are certain things that I just would not debate on here, because I feel so strongly and passionately about them that I know I would get worked up and carried away with what I was saying, and then feel bad that I might have offended someone. Perhaps some things are better left unsaid? We all have different opinions and are all equally entitled to them - what a boring place the world would be if we all thought the same. Kaye x

Oh dear - poor Lucia will be getting a complex. I dont believe that Helen has aimed this thread at Lucia nor any other 'one individual' .............. I believe her 'objection' was to the opinion voiced that smokers have no human rights.

What needs to be remembered on this discussion board is that NOBODY's opinion is more important than anyone else's. Nobody takes precedence here, we're all on an equal footing, and if Lucia or anyone else expresses an opinion that most others disagree with, it doesn't mean that they are wrong and the majority is right. For many years now, I've believed that there are no rights or wrongs, just differences of opinion. That's not something I read or was told - it's my own conclusion, reached after a lifetime's experience of meeting people from all classes, races, religions, and 'walks of life', reading books and articles on religion, philosophy and psychology, and considering people's motivation and behaviour. I've listened to many an expression of passionately held views and considered them alongside my own, and I don't follow anyone else's path, I create my own. These days, it seems that truth can be whatever an individual believes it to be. Discussing various issues with people on this board, and watching others' discussions in which I've taken no part, has strengthened my belief that discussion of sensitive issues will always lead to some people's views being dominant and others' views being rubbished. It's just human nature, and some people feel more strongly about certain issues. That doesn't mean that 'Might is RIght'. It doesn't mean that a vociferous minority should prevent less strident voices being heard. Whoever you are, DON'T be put off expressing your own views if you want to. You have as much right to do so as anyone else. Lucia has always seemed to me to be a level-headed young lady who thinks a great deal. She may be young, but that doesn't mean her views aren't valid. Maybe she hasn't had the chance yet to experience many things that older people have and her views may change later, but I for one have encountered plenty of older people who appear to have learned very little from life and just go along with the views they've been taught to hold or views they]ve absorbed by association with more dominant characters or read/watched from various media. Lucia is at a key stage in her life, with major exams looming. From what I've seen of her, she'll go far. From what I've seen of some people on this board, they'll never go far enough! CB >|<

Paul I hope you don't think I was implying she was picked on. That's certainly not what I meant :-)

How can you debate something without both sides of the arguement? Lucia is young ( to use an example)- the opinions she holds/values she hold now may well change as she matures/grows/experiences life. That is what growing up is all about. Would i advocate to my children - i dont have any incedentally- to do as i did as a teen /young adult? dont know! my ideals/views have changed, and if you have only ever ONCE thought back to something your parent said and thought about it and even wondered if they were maybe right, (although you disagreed at the time)then you to have 'grown' in your 'thought process' as no doubt all youngers will. Jess x

Think your opinions are pretty much in line with the average person and the mainly silent authority. (who normally go unrecognised) The problem sometimes is that when I see something as black or white. there are always a few people who don,t, and they are willing to argue their case - generally, but not always, in a proper manner. That,s just the way things are, and probably rightly so. Happy days

Thankyou Heather!! who knows maybe one day i will give up!! but it's got to be because i want to and not because i have been ordered to!! Love Helenxx

Thanks Paul i don't want to start a war or fall out with anyone!! and i respect your views, i just think sometimes it would be good idea not to express our views wholeheartedly, I would'nt dream of inflicting my habit on you or anyone else, Love Helenxx

Helen agree with you, if you want to smoke do it. I'm a none smoker and would not tell an adult how to conduct their lives :)) Heather

Helen, sorry didn't see that comment. What I will say though, is that in my opinion... you inflict the smoke upon your own lungs. You shouldn't have a right to inflict ot on other people. I'm assuming what the person meant was that the non smokers right to clean(ish) air should take priority over your right to pollute your lungs. I happen to agree with that. I'm not saying you don't have the right to smoke, you do, just not around people who don't want to breath in your smoke. See, I'm disagreeing with you, but doing it politely, good iniit :o) I also think Lucia handled the debate well last night, and I hope she's not upset by the responses, I don't think anyone was particularly nasty to her, and I resent the implication (not from you Helen) that she was in any way picked on. Paul

Helen - I have to agree with you on the smoking threads. I did feel it was a bit 'lets gang up on the smokers' ........... I am an occasional on and off smoker - so I have a foot in both camps - I smoke, but I do object to other peoples smoke and I try to be as considerate to others as I can IF I smoke in public ............ mostly tho I smoke in my own home - or outside my house on MY property :O)) That said I have nothing against a good debate but it can go overboard sometimes xxxx

Thankyou all for your replies!! Lucia's threads did not bring this about!! i hold Lucia's opinions in high regard, for a young woman she is absolutely right in what she believes and it's heart warming to hear such good responses to the questions she was asked, so if you read this Lucia good on yer girl!!!! it's the smoking threads, that got me thinking. We all know the opinions about smoking, i for one agree with a lot of them thats why i only smoke in my own back garden, it's my habit and personal to me i inflict it on no one!! but i read a thread yesterday which stated that smokers should'nt have human rights!!! why not i am human i do everything thats expected of me as far as smoking. there have been other issues on here as well which lead me to believe i am the only one who thinks different to everyone else!! Helenxx

When something on the board really really really gets to me like yesterdays smoking debate I get it all out in one go on a new thread, blow my top stamp my feet have a hissy fit then I feel much better much prefer to get it all out in one go. The board debates make very interesting reading. xxhugxx

I have been called 'beyond the pale' because of my personal stance on abortion. If making people like me means agreeing it's ok to destroy life then they are not the sort of people whose friendship I particularly want. There are lots of things I stand for but others stand against. I am prepared to listen to anyone's view on any given topic as long as they don't expect me to lower my belief standard to match theirs. I love the way Lucia has conveyed her personal beliefs without getting personal.

Helen ..... I agree with some of your opinions and not others. I respect your right to hold these opinions and to voice them as and when you wish. I might debate certain issues with you but I certainly would not expect you to agree and would not think any the less of you because you didn't. Live and let live, that's my motto. Jean x.

im not suprised she took it to heart, she was asked her opinions gave them and i think it was wrong in a way to ask her. Obviousley people are gonna come back saying thats not right and blah blah blah, there are gay/lesbian people on this site and although she didnt want to offend maybe she has. Now i dont know her that well, but if i was her i would feel intimidated upset and hurt and NOBODY should make a young girl feel in that way. Look at the average age on here, its mostly 'adults', well maybe sometimes should take a step back and think of peoples FEELINGS not just think of how much they want to bring their thoughts and opinions to light. Lucia if your around ((((((((((hugs)))))))))) to you hun xxxxxxx

Helen, Surely if a discussionis one sided, and everyone is agreeing... there's nothing sinister in that ? it just means that everyone agrees !!! I have no qualms about disagreeing with the masses, and have done so about 'smokers rights' in the past few days. I think the smoking issue is one area where we've seen a lot of people both for and against the ban. I'm at a bit of a loss, as I can't see what you're disgusted about. Paul