Genealogy Chat

Kate.A big big Thank you,I have sent you mail. Best Wishes from Anne.

Okay, well, I think you are going to have to do some hard slogging through censuses and BMD indexes now! Unfortunately Jane's mother (if it is her) couldn't decide (a) whether her first name was Mary or Bridget - spelt any way you like - (b) how to spell her surname (c) when she was born. Her estimated birth year varies from 1817 to 1831! This all makes it pretty difficult and time-consuming to search for her on the censuses. If you can find Jane's birth registration (again, estimates of the year vary, from 1852 to 1858, but she could be older), it would help a lot, but because of the variations in spelling of surname it will take you a while to find it. I don't think FreeBMD is complete for those years so you would have to look on 1837 online or Family Relatives. If you can't find hers, you could look for Will(iam)'s or Ann's - though it is only a theory of mine that Ann was a Kershaw (oh, and try looking for Ann's marriage to George Heath or North or whatever it says) - and if all that fails, start trying to find where those Spencer children came from, who their mother was, whether she started out as a Kershaw... or look for the death of Edward Kershaw. All that could keep you busy for a long long time!! And don't forget to post up a request for an expert on Co. Longford in Ireland to decipher / translate that place name given as Mary's birthplace on the 1881. It will be best to start a new thread for that, with a title something like 'Help with place name in Co. Longford Ireland', and give the full reference details from ancestry so that people can find the image quickly. Happy hunting! Kate.

This could be Mary / Bridget and Will in 1871 (but no Jane): View Record Name Estimated Birth Year Birthplace Relationship Civil Parish or Township County/Island View Image View Record Mary Kershaw abt 1817 Ireland Lodger Kirkdale Lancashire View Record William Kershaw abt 1848 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Son Kirkdale Lancashire View Record George Spencer abt 1867 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Grandson Kirkdale Lancashire This is the family they are lodging with, and presumably there is some connection if Eliza Spencer is George's niece and George Spencer is Mary's grandson. View Record Name Estimated Birth Year Birthplace Relationship Civil Parish or Township County/Island View Image View Record Ann North abt 1841 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Wife Kirkdale Lancashire View Record George North abt 1841 Wakefield, Yorkshire, England Head Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Eliza Spencer abt 1863 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Niece Kirkdale Lancashire 'North' looks more like 'Heath' to me. My first guess is that Ann is Mary's daughter (and therefore Jane's sister), and that another sister married a Mr. Spencer and had Eliza and George, but it is going to take a bit of investigating! Mary is a widow, by the way. Back soon, no doubt! Kate.

Oooh, just looked at the image, and found that two of the 'neighbours' are actually in the same household as Richard and Jane!!: Briget Coshan abt 1825 Ireland Mother (Head) 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England Will. Coshan abt 1853 Liverpool Son 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England That gives us a bit more information, doesn't it? Kate.

Well, this is Richard and Jane in 1881: View Record Name Estimated Birth Year Birthplace Relationship Residence View Image View Record James Coop abt 1880 Kirkdale Son 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England View Record Jane Coop abt 1856 Liverpool Wife 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England View Record Jane Elizabeth Coop abt 1879 Kirkdale Daughter 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England View Record Richard Coop abt 1851 Walton Head 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England View Record Robert Coop abt 1877 Kirkdale Son 29 Fountin Rd, Kirkdale, Lancashire, England I'll keep looking... Kate.

I'm not getting anywhere looking for them on other censuses at the minute and will have to leave it till tomorrow now. But one thing I do notice from the 1891 is that Jane sr's age is given as 33, although according to her marriage certificate she should be about 38 by now! Richard should be about 41, so his age given as 42 isn't too unlikely. But anyway, it means that Jane could have been lying about her age when she got married? More likely to have been lying about it - or unsure - on the census though, to make herself seem younger. Which makes me wonder if her mother Mary could also have been lying about her age? So that 1831 might only be a very rough idea of when she was born. But I still say we need somebody who knows County Longford to decipher that place name from 1891, which should be quite a help. Kate.

Now the rest of them. Cooke, Annie H abt 1886 Kirkdale; Liverpool Daughter Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, Cecily A abt 1890 Kirkdale; Liverpool Daughter Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, Emily M abt 1883 Kirkdale; Liverpool Daughter Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, James abt 1881 Kirkdale; Liverpool Son Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, Jane abt 1858 Prescot Wife Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, Jane abt 1879 Kirkdale; Liverpool Daughter Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, Mary L abt 1885 Kirkdale; Liverpool Daughter Kirkdale Lancashire View Record Cooke, Richard abt 1889 Kirkdale; Liverpool Son Kirkdale Lancashire Cooke, Robert abt 1877 Kirkdale; Liverpool Son Kirkdale Lancashire Kirlsmam, Mary abt 1831 Clumrmris Lang, Ireland Grandmother, Grandma Kirkdale Lancashire We need an Ireland expert to decipher Mary's birthplace on the image because it is something Longford, perhaps Clum miris Longford Ireland? Anyway, she is obviously not Richard's grandmother! Kate.

This is Richard on 1891, just getting the stuff from the next page... back in a minute... 1891 England Census Record about Richard Cooke Name: Cooke, Richard Age: 42 Estimated birth year: abt 1849 Relation: Head Gender: Male Where Born: Walton; Liverpool Civil parish: Kirkdale Ecclesiastical parish: St Athanasius County/Island: Lancashire Street address: View Image Condition as to marriage: View Image Education: View Image Employment status: View Image Occupation: View Image Source information: RG12/2964 Registration district: West Derby Sub registration district: Kirkdale ED, institution, or vessel: 26 Folio: 16 Page: 25 (click to see others on page) GSU Number: 6098074

No matches for Kirlsmaw anywhere on ancestry. I suppose it was ancestry you found her on? It's just that if we could look at the entry on the 1891 it might help us find them on other censuses etc. Kate.

Thank you Jess, Everton is a district in Liverpool.I hope that I am not doing my g/g/grandmother Mary an injustice but I am beginning to wonder if Jane was born,as they used to say,out of wedlock.I much appreciate your answering me. Anne

have just pasted that surname in to 1891 -still cant find her what town was she in please - Everton? click on add a reply at the very top of the screen

then i will C& P it here, many eyes make light work, or something kime that .Jane was married on 14/04/1876 to Richard Cooke,Reg district West Derby,Liverpool. They were married in The Wesleyian Methodist Chapel in Gt Homer St.Everton both living in Luther St,Everton at the time. Jane is noted at being 23 and Richard 26. Their witnesses are a Hannah Metcalfe and George (Dayston?) .Jane's mother Mary is on the 1891 census living with the family in 92 Fountains Rd detailed as being Mary Kirlsmaw a retired Mouthly nurse all I would think as misspellings. Richard Cooke as the head is on one page,the rest of the family on the following

Hi Kate and Jess my reply messages are not appearing have they gone direct to you. Anne

who did she marry where did she marry when did she marry who were the witnesses how old did she say she was- is that backed up by earlier census data? Kate , any consolation i cant see Mum on 1891 either!

Does it really give her year of birth on her marriage certificate? If so, what country did she marry in? If not, can you give us the date of the marriage and the age it says for her? I can't even find her mother on the 1891 census - is she mistranscribed on ancestry? Kate.

On my g/grandmothers wedding certificate it states ,Jane Kershaw,born in Prescot Liverpool in 1853,father Edward Kershaw deceased,a commercial traveller.I have scoured all websites including Ancestry and have found that Jane's mother Mary was born in Longford,Ireland in 1831,this is recorded on the England 1891 census.Thats it,I have no other recorded information on this paternal line.I would be very grateful for any advice as I could have a nervous breakdown soon. Regards from Anne.