Genealogy Chat

I have asked for help with this before but am still no further forward. I am trying to establish whether Ann Marshall and James Marshall, both born Yorkshire in 1805 and 1806 respectively, are siblings. I have had some professional help and paid for some research but have not been able to find the link that I need. It may be that I am missing something obvious or that I have just got the srong area. I have now put all the basic info into a word document and am asking anyone who feels that they may have a little spare time to have a look at it for me. Perhaps those that are kind enough to offer help would email me and I will send the details to them. in hopes Sylvie

Sylvie The only thing that will show if they are siblings is if they have the same parents in their baptism records. On the other hand if the mum and dad are called Ann and John, I expect there could be many folk with those names. You just say they were born Yorkshire. I believe Yorkshire is the biggest county in England & Wales, so unless they come from the same, or nearby villages, I wouldn't think there was a connection. nell

Thanks Helen - you are in the notes that I hope people will ask for! You may recall finding a large Marshall family in Escrick for me on family search - just one was missing and that was 'my' James! There is more that just a birthplace to this. I have a family legend that links them and the families of James and Ann are seen to be living close to one another in London and there are other things that make me think that they are siblings. I just need the proof!

Well I think that the only proof you can get is that Ann and John share the same parents - or at least the same father, and you can only do that by getting the father's name from baptism records, unless they both married after 1837, in which case it would be on their marriage certs. nell

you are right but if I can hit upon a family with these two siblings with the right baptism dates then I might be able to get other documentation for instance a will that might cement things together a little more. I should have said that I would just like to get a little closer than I am to thinking it is just coincidence. The trouble with baptism records is that I am confused about where to look because the writing on various census records is so poor - which is why someone with some Yorkshire knowledge might be able to shed light on an area for me. I am so very down about this

Sylvie Nell is right, you need to look at baptism records. You need to see which record office covers where they were born. Do not worry re the writing as very often these are much clearer and very often amusing, depending on the vicar. Anyway if you are seeking a will, these can be very illegible John

Yes I know all that but I don't know which parish records to consult because I need help with the place names. I don't think anyone will be able to help me unless they are prepared to look at what has been done so far - for instance, I have consulted tens of parish records in Yorkshire and so far, they are all wrong Thanks for trying to help anyway. I'm going to give this up I think, I don't know where else to go for help Sylvie

Sylvie So are you saying that you cannot read the birthplaces for John and Ann on the census, or you cannot find a place that matches the census, or that it just says Yorkshire on the census? nell

It's long and complicated and a mixture of both really which is why I felt I couldn't write it all on here, However, I can see you are trying to help and I am VERY grateful ALl the census records for Ann MArshall just say born Youkshire 1805 The census records (51-91) for James all say Yorkshire but many of the placenames are indistinct. I have had help before in trying to interpret them and have as an examples Womersley; Sherburn Kirkburn Thirburn and Naburn: Dralon Deeton Deighton etc. Place names in his will cover Lennerton, Ferrybridge and Sveamons - which could be Smeaton as in Kirk Smeaton (I have a map!) I'm sinking in Yorkshire! Sylvie

So are none of these from 1851 your chap: James Marshall abt 1806 Morley, Yorkshire, England Head Bradford Yorkshire James Marshall abt 1806 Pudsey, Yorkshire, England Head Pudsey Yorkshire James Marshall abt 1806 West Heslerton, Yorkshire, England Head Wintringham Yorkshire nell

Sylvie Thinking this over, unless you have a place name for Ann, I don't see how you can work this out. Even if you find a baptism for John in a likely place and he has a sister called Ann, without the placename in the census, you can't necessarily connect the two. How did you come to link them in the first place, just that they are both called Marshall and born around the same time in Yorkshire? nell

Hi Nell No my James is 1851 born 1806 Womersley. I know it is him from his occupation as a silk mercer. I have all the references in the word document I prepared. Two of my father's cousins told me that there was a family connection to JAmes MArshall of Marshall and Snelgrove. I then found that my grandmothers grandmother was an Ann MArshall born in Yorkshire a year before James. They lived close to each other in London. Indeed within a few doors of each other at one point, Need to go now to get ready to dance - it's Saturday night! Sylvie

Only two Marshall baptisms for Womersley on IGI - neither of them yours, of course! But this one could be a sibling: IGI Individual Record FamilySearch™ International Genealogical Index v5.0 British Isles MARTHA MARSHALL Female Birth: 07 JUN 1808 Christening: 11 JUN 1808 Womersley, Yorkshire, Parents: Father: THOMAS MARSHALL Mother: MARY Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date. Source Information: Batch No.: C108342 Dates: 1730 - 1812

Thanks Nell but I already have the Womersley records I really do just need someone who will look through the word document I have written and who knows the area, otherwise all you kind folk are just repeating what I have already done Thanks anyway Sylvie

can't find him in 1851. Found him in the later ones, no wiser on the placenames Incredible, 5 goes at giving you his birthplace, all screwed up Looking on abebooks(.)co.uk, there's a couple of old books about Marshall & Snelgrove available second-hand which might just shed some light on James's background (or of course they might just say James came from Yorkshire)

Thanks Robin You'll find hi9m on the 51 as J Marshall - but then this is the only one that is legible - ie Womersley. As for the books - I already have them. As I said to Nell, I have so much information that I have put it all in a word document that I will forward to anyone who feels that they could take a look at the whole picture for me Sylvie