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Elsie was born 1914 (unless late 1913 reg early 1914)

Births Mar 1914 (>99%)
WELBY Elsie Sherwood Prestwich 8d 802 Scan available - click to view
Births Mar 1915 (>99%)
WELBY Annie Isherwood Prestwich 8d 823 Scan available - click to view
Births Sep 1919 (>99%)
Welby John P Isherwood Prestwich 8d 631

Annie was married from this address in 1897 so there must be some connection here but I can't seem to link it up to Annie:

1901
ISHERWOOD, Wm Head Married M 34 1867 General Labourer Manchester Lancashire
ISHERWOOD, Mary Ann Wife Married F 29 1872 Manchester Lancashire
ISHERWOOD, John N Son Single M 9 1892 Manchester Lancashire
ISHERWOOD, Susannah Daughter Single F 7 1894 Manchester Lancashire
ISHERWOOD, Ada Daughter Single F 5 1896 Manchester Lancashire
ISHERWOOD, Herman Son Single M 2 1899 Manchester Lancashire


RG number:
RG13 Piece:
3760 Folio:
161 Page:
12

Sub District:
Newton Enumeration District:
25 Ecclesiastical Parish:
Newton Heath St Mark

Municipal Borough:
Address:
18, George Street, North Manchester County:
Lancashire


Dea x

That 1911 looks VERY interesting Maureen - I will go and take a look!

Dea x

EDIT - It HAS to be them - It does say Welby on image! - I just don't know why his middle name should now be James??

This means that her place of birth is consistant at Bolton on both census.

Dea x

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1895
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
WELBY James SHAW Annie Manchester Register Office or Registrar Attended Manchester MCR_RM/135/115

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1897
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
WELBY John P ISHERWOOD Annie Prestwich Registrar Attended Manchester PRE_RM/33/77

Just in case,although the father's name is "off":
1911 census transcription details for: 89 Malcolm Street Clayton Manchester
RG14PN24311 RG78PN1393 RD467 SD6 ED30 SN180

Reg. District: Prestwich Sub District: Bradford
WELLEY, John James Head Married M 34 1877 Coal Miner Hewer Bradford Manchester
WELLEY, Annie Wife Married
15 years F 34 1877 Bolton Lancashire
WELLEY, George Son Single M 12 1899 School Beswick Manchester
WELLEY, Nelly Daughter Single F 9 1902 School Beswick Manchester
WELLEY, Robert Son ? Clayton Manchester
STANLEY, Harry Boarder Single M 18 1893 Collier Hewer Hulme Salford


Maureen

Well, no use yet with Annie, I am afraid but, in case you are not aware of this, this is son George
travelling to Australia in 1923, intending to make it is permenant home:

passenger transcript details
Name: Mr Geo WELBY
Date of departure: 28 March 1923
Port of departure: London
Passenger destination port: Melbourne, Australia
Passenger destination: Melbourne, Australia

Date of Birth: 1901 (calculated from age)
Age: 22
Marital status:
Sex: Male
Occupation: Coal Miner

Ship:

EURIPIDES
133648
P J Collins
The Aberdeen
Australia
19104
9399
702

His home address was 15 Baslow St., Beswick, Manchester which ties in with the birth cert of his sister Elsie at that address in 1913 according to your tree on Ancestry!

Dea x

P.S. - Your tree on Ancestry also has the birth details of Annie as 29/4/1878 in Moston, Manchester - was this an error?

Dea x

I don't believe that is the correct 1911 you have posted Shirley.
The husband is JAMES and should be John - occupations not quite right either and they have all 7 of their 'born' children listed on there.

JOHN and Annie had a son George on 1901 and he is not included!

I thik that family belongs to the marriage in 1895 of JAMES Welby + Annie Shaw.

I can't find the correct one on 1911 at the moment though - will take another look.

Dea x

Can we go back to that marriage cert please?

Could you give us ALL the details - occupation, fathers, addresses, ages, witnesses etc.

Dea x

Thank you all so much for your suggestions, I now have more possibilities :-S

This could be tricky I think. Maybe I should try to establish if she had brothers and sisters first??

if Annie is not sure where she was born (1901 Bolton, 1911 Manchester) is this another possibility?

James WARD Head M Male 24 Beech Bank, Stafford, England Fireman Or Stoker
Emma WARD Wife M Female 29 Manchester, Lancashire, England Wife
Annie ISHERWOOD Step Daur U Female 5 Salford, Lancashire, England Scholar

Source Information:
Dwelling No 30 Monmouth St
Census Place Salford, Lancashire, England
Family History Library Film 1341949
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 3976 / 76
Page Number 8

So from her baptism her parents were John and Elizabeth

to match that 1881 census of Shirley's

Baptisms: 13 Jun 1876 St James, New Bury, Farnworth, Lancashire, England
Ann Isherwood - Child of John Isherwood & Elizabeth
Abode: Bolton Union Workhouse St. James New Bury
Occupation: Stripper & Grinder
Baptised by: C.J. Stewart
Register: Baptisms 1875 - 1884, Page 7, Entry 49
Source: Microfilm of register at Manchester Library

so if she was baptised Ann she could have been registered as Ann
depends how old she was at baptism

Name: ISHERWOOD, Ann
Registration District: Bolton
County: Lancashire
Year of Registration: 1876
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
Mother's Maiden Name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume No: 8C
Page No: 317

I would look on genuki and find out where the parish of St Jude's is that's if you think the above census a right

I'm trying to find out what Annie's parents were called. I've established her father was John Isherwood but until I get the correct birth certificate I am unsure of her mother's name.
I found:
1878 Salford 8d 65
1878 Prestwich 8d 459
1878 Biggleswade 3b 352
1878 Warrington 8c 235
1876 Chorlton 8c 808
plus a few more
any advise on how to narrow this down???
:-D

1911
WELBY, James Head Married M 35 1876 Iron Driller Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, Annie Wife Married
15 years F 37 1874 Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, John Son Single M 15 1896 Office Boy Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, Ellen Daughter F 13 1898 School Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, Annie Daughter F 11 1900 School Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, James Son M 8 1903 School Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, Matilda Daughter F 6 1905 School Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, May Daughter F 4 1907 Lancashire Manchester VIEW
WELBY, Edith Daughter F 0 (10 WEEKS) 1911 Lancashire Manchester VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
24111 Reference:
RG14PN24111 RG78PN1385 RD466 SD1 ED23 SN97

Registration District:
Manchester Sub District:
Ancoats Enumeration District:
23 Parish:
Manchester

Address:
6 Kirkham St Ancoats Manchester County:
Lancashire

Name: Annie Welby
Birth Date: abt 1875
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1950
Age at Death: 75
Registration district: Manchester
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 10e
Page: 311

so possibly born late 1875/6

1901 says born Bolton

Name: Annie Welby
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John Welby
Gender: Female
Where born: Bolton, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: North Manchester
Ecclesiastical parish: Miles Platting St Luke
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Prestwich
Sub-registration district: Newton
ED, institution, or vessel: 19
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 207
Piece: 3760
Folio: 22
Page Number: 35
Household Members: Name Age
John Welby 23
Annie Welby 25
George Welby 1
Catherine Welby 18
Henrietta Carter 18


Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 3760; Folio: 22; Page: 35.

aptisms: 13 Jun 1876 St James, New Bury, Farnworth, Lancashire, England
Ann Isherwood - Child of John Isherwood & Elizabeth
Abode: Bolton Union Workhouse St. James New Bury
Occupation: Stripper & Grinder
Baptised by: C.J. Stewart
Register: Baptisms 1875 - 1884, Page 7, Entry 49
Source: Microfilm of register at Manchester Library

I believe you can order through the GRO without the GRO ref .costs a little more but you can specify checking points like parensts names you give the birth year and I believe they will search 3 years around the date.

Did she have siblings that you can find births for, if so one of their certs too or finding them together on census will gives mums christian name